Updated 12:27 p.m.
Per CB3: Depending on the attendance, seating may be limited due to social distancing. The meeting will also be live-streamed here. Comments may also be submitted to mn03@cb.nyc.gov. to be considered for the September vote.
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City officials from the Department of City Planning and Department of Transportation are exploring an overhaul of zoning and permitting regulations to allow the Open Restaurants program to become permanent.
In an email, the group members state:
As Crain's reported, the city had to suspend roughly 20 zoning rules when Mayor de Blasio announced the program in June 2020.
The Open Restaurants text amendment entered public review on June 21. This proposal is the first of a series of changes to create the permanent Open Restaurants program.
Per the city:
In addition to the zoning amendment, the City will move administration of the sidewalk café program from the Department of Consumer Affairs and Workforce Protection to DOT, streamline the application process and create rules for a permanent roadway dining program. Altogether, restaurants will have a single agency to go to apply for outdoor dining, with a clear set of design guidelines on what is allowed.
And:
The proposed zoning text amendment would affect every community district within the City. The proposed action would remove the definitions of sidewalk cafes from the Zoning Resolution and any mentions of them in special districts, as well as other clean-up text to fully remove any zoning prohibitions related to the operation of sidewalk cafes.
Tonight, there's an in-person presentation, discussion and public testimony at a joint Community Board 3 Committee meeting. (See below for the meeting details.) As part of the public review process, the CB3 Committees will produce a resolution, which the full board will vote on in September.
Several community groups are encouraging participation. According to an email yesterday from the East Village Community Coalition (EVCC):
"This meeting is your opportunity to share your concerns about whether/how this program should continue, and how it might be improved, while the details are still being hashed out. If this privatization of public space is to become permanent, residents and business owners should have input."The EVCC also calls attention to other issues that they see with the program.
This emergency program, while critical for struggling restaurants, has created untenable noise and sanitation issues for neighborhoods with high concentrations of eating and drinking establishments:
• amplified music, smoking and crowds below residents' windows
• bags of trash and discarded containers exacerbating rat problems
• choked paths for pedestrians and emergency vehicles
• fire safety concerns about the use and storage of propane heaters
None of these issues are readily resolved through the usual channels, leaving very little recourse for residents or business owners. This has not changed, even as problems worsen with increasing traffic as the City reopens.In addition, several neighbor groups — LES Dwellers, Orchard Street Block Association, the Chinatown Core and the East Fifth Street Block Association — are urging residents to voice any concerns about the Open Restaurants program...
In many areas, the eating and drinking sheds have become severely problematic. As such, we are adamantly opposed to Outdoor Dining Sheds becoming a permanent fixture in NYC. We appreciate that these sheds were a lifeline for the hospitality industry during the pandemic and allowed residents a safe place to social distance.
Since COVID restrictions have been lifted, we think it is time for the emergency dining sheds to be retired, and the sidewalk cafe process is reinstated regarding alfresco dining.
However, you feel about the Open Restaurants program, no public input or proper environmental impact study was commissioned. Instead, the city rammed the sheds through behind closed doors with little to no oversight, calling it an unbridled success with few issues to resolve.
Last week, Gov. Cuomo signed legislation extending the usage of municipal spaces for restaurants through the middle of next year.
Tonight's in-person Committee meeting starts at 6:30 at the Boys Club of New York, 287 E. 10th St. at Avenue A. You can find a copy of the presentation at this link.
A huge gift of public common land to the hospitality industry is also the most detrimental attack on quality of life for city residents. The rat population in the EV has skyrocket in recent month due to the night buffet of garbage and food waste in and around these sheds and the garbage bags left in streets for more than 24 hours. NYC city is being run by an administration hell bent on selling alcohol which in turns brings in tax revenue while turning our streets and sidewalks into squalor.
ReplyDeletesanitation department needs to step up their ticketing game.. some restaurants dont know how to be responsible for their own messes
ReplyDeleteOpen Restaurants was a good emergency program but making it permanent with virtually no public input is unjust and unfair and sacrifices quality of life especially at the expense of residents who live above or across the street from bars and restaurants. The noise is relentless and the city has nothing in place to address the noise other than for residents to call 311 which is virtually useless as the sea of noise rolls up and down the street.
ReplyDeleteWhen King Charles stole the public commons we know what happened to him!
ReplyDeleteWE NEED CROMWELL NOW MORE THAN EVER!
It is a giveaway to Wall Street and the 1% and a MASSIVE SOCIAL tax on the residents.
I am so sick of having to see the privileged people eating. Most repulsive is seeing their waste and half-eaten plates.
Whether due to construction, delivery trucks or idling cars , the obstruction of bike lanes has always been an ongoing safety issue.
ReplyDeleteBut now with outdoor dining, it seems drivers making a turn around these outdoor structures do not see cyclists or pedestrians crossing the crosswalk and there's also a considerable increase in idling commercial cars waiting to pick up a passenger or idling commercial delivery trucks blocking bike lanes making bicycle commutes feel less safe.
the brigade of car loving nimbys has arrived. hope these sheds stay forever
ReplyDeleteSome people actually need and use their cars to like make a living.... because not all work is accessible through public transit. And some of us have relied on our cars take that income for like 15+ years... so yeah cars exist deal with it.
DeleteCars exist but only a small portion of the community owns them, and space should be distributed for betterment of whole community not car-owning few.
DeleteCorrect me if I'm wrong, but, aren't sidewalk cafes enough for the hospitality industry to survive? After all, it worked for all those years prior to the pandemic. Where's the logic to all this spilling into the streets?
ReplyDeleteThis misguided approach chokes the vital flow of all services to the residents and businesses who actually live in those neighborhoods.
Love the outdoor restaurants and think permanent is a good idea. That said, there needs to be some controls so residents can sleep: no amplified sound, and outdoor seating should shut down at 11, just like there were already controls for back yard outdoor restaurant spaces.
ReplyDeleteI don't understand why everyone who has issues with outdoor dining is categorically opposed as opposed to focusing on the real issues (e.g. loud outdoor speakers). I empathize with how frustrating that must be but also think there are real tangible benefits, including taking back streets for the public good, making our city more oriented on outdoor activities, supporting businesses, etc. Also, I agree there is an argument to be made around making these spaces free vs. not. Again that's a simple solve - free for another year and after that you pay for the right.
ReplyDeleteIf this passes and these sheds become permanent, my time residing in this great neighborhood are sadly over
ReplyDeleteTear ‘em down, the pandemic is over in the city.
ReplyDeleteMaking the streets people friendly is for the public good, pandemic or not
DeleteAh, another "emergency" program that interested parties now want to suddenly solidify into PERMANENT, without ANY input from the legal residents of this area. NO, NO, NO!
ReplyDeleteThe rat population is beyond-beyond, and that's due in large part to all the outdoor dining.
IMO, the restaurant owners, who deserved compassion & support are now getting extremely greedy, and I'll remember that when choosing where to eat.
There is ZERO REASON to give restaurants (for free) the public space that is designated as a parking lane. Given that so many people don't want cars to be able to park for free, why should restaurants be able to increase their income-producing square footage for free??
This situation is, IMO, outta control, and if they make it permanent, you WILL see changes to this neighborhood and to Manhattan in general that will be to its detriment. Unless, of course, the City of New York is TRYING to become a tenth-world city.
There is also zero reason to give up such vast public space for free car storage. So let’s use so much common space not for car storage or for business but for neighborhood folks to enjoy!
Delete…then I should be allowed to park my car or set up a business in front if my coop building.
ReplyDeleteA problem with these outdoor dining areas, is the the street sweepers can not clean the corners of the structures. Restaurant owners do not clean the corners because they feel that it is city property. So garbage and dirt accumulate. Not good to eat near, let alone the appearance.
ReplyDelete@ 9:01
ReplyDeleteI never owned a car not. driver's license so you are wrong about my opposition to the street and sidewalk takeover by landlords. These sheds are a fire hazard and there has been two cases already where the NYFD could not get close enough to a building which was on fire. The list goes on how wrong this is for a post pandemic city. This city will become unlivable to anyone wants to sleep or not watch rats rule the streets.
The blatant abuse of the sidewalk space by Pocco is one great example to get rid of the shanty shacks.
ReplyDeletePoco was WAY more annoying pre pandemic.
DeleteHere we go again.... The puritanical killjoys who exist only in the comments section of this website, and in CB3, have once again embarked on their perpetual quest to destroy any creative ideas anyone might have for a more pleasant and sensual atmosphere on our streets. God forbid our sidewalks and curbs should be places one wants to hang out with friends. We should all be home watching TV and enjoying the cicadas and songbirds (and vehicle traffic noise and smog) wafting in our open windows.
ReplyDeleteI sympathize with the restaurant owners that needed these sheds to survive but now in a choice between sheds or no sheds - I would say no sheds. They are mostly built with ramshackle tendency and veer towards unsightly. Aesthetics aside, I believe they are more of a detriment than a benefit for the neighborhood.
ReplyDelete"I don't understand why everyone who has issues with outdoor dining is categorically opposed as opposed to focusing on the real issues (e.g. loud outdoor speakers)."
ReplyDeleteBecause many of them are really just mad about the parking and using everything else as a stalking horse.
Personally, I think the program should continue, but it needs some real modifications and a commitment to enforcement. Noise/music, rats, and obstructed sidewalk access have to be addressed.
IMO---just about EVERY small business will 'stretch' rules to turn a profit---it's up to sensible governance to correct unlawful activity---restaurants cannot be left on their own to police these structures (it took owners MONTHS to understand (sic) the 50% air flow rule---JUST ENFORCE RULES :)
ReplyDeleteI don’t live in a commercial and residential zone, but I can see how the noise would be excruciating and trash problems really bad. On principle, I love love the idea of streets becoming more of a public space. And I love love the idea of encouraging public life to exist outside. When the city ended bars/restaurants selling booze to go, that felt draconian. I think what this all reveals as well is that there isn’t enough outdoor space for the amount of people living in the city. What if every block had green space. I love seeing this outdoor dining, and I do think it’s a disgrace not to consider residents perspectives before moving forward. I hope there could be a world that would allow them to exist and take into consideration and hopefully find solutions to the problems that have emerged. Of course, this takes time to figure out. Which is the one thing I hoped the « post-pandemic » world would take more of, but it seems the rushing of things is back and so I don’t have too much confidence in this process really taking the time to do it right, but I hope at least voicing concerns will slow it down!
ReplyDeleteI live on first ave, where we never had any outdoor dining. Now, drunk, loud obnoxious people are sitting outside all night. Get rid of these sheds.
ReplyDeleteA quick follow up— many neighborhoods have sidewalk culture already. People sitting on the street outside their stoop, people grilling in the front gate area. To co-exist successfully, it seems you have to know your neighbors. You have to be able to shout down- Hey, I have a super early morning can you turn the music down. Part of the problem with this new world, is that many restaurants aren’t necessarily there for their neighbors, or don’t get to know their neighbors. What if you could go downstairs and have an espresso at your local outdoor dining place each morning? Part of making this successful might be facilitating a way for the restaurants to get to know their neighbors. Making it all more personal. Building that fabric. Maybe restaurants should be required to host a communal, on-the-house dinner for the residents in their building, and the landlord doesn’t get to skip out! A gesture of let’s get to know each other. Perhaps it’s utopian thinking, but at least worth a shot.
ReplyDeleteAbsolutely absurd to claim the sidewalk sheds are the ‘privatization of public space’ — as though a parking space were some kind of city park. What is a more communal use of this space: a place to temporarily silo a personal vehicle, or 2-3 tables where people can gather and socialize in the neighborhood in comparatively greater safety from the (ongoing) pandemic? If you own and operate a personal vehicle in NYC of all places, you are doing far more to contribute to the filth, noise and air pollution of this city than the Open Restaurants ever could; please re-evaluate why you choose to continue living in a major metropolis with such lifestyle demands.
ReplyDeleteNo but a parking space is shared and Public, and they matter for a lot of businesses and residents and normal life.
DeleteThe sidewalks in southern Manhattan aren’t wide enough to continue this charade.
ReplyDeleteThen it’s not big enough for cars either
DeleteTo all those who want permanent sidewalk sheds, may you always live on a block that not only is a destination for the bro set, but has 10 sidewalk bar/restaurants, many sheds, and bro building party roofs packed from Thursday through Sunday, just like my block.
ReplyDeleteUltimately, this is a give-away of public space to private interests. This is a perfect "Shock Doctrine" scenario, where politicians push through unpopular ideas during a crisis to benefit their donors. There is so little public space already, especially with our politicians voting to decimate parks like East River Park and Governors Island. No to the land grab of public space!
ReplyDeleteAnd no land grab back for free car storage! Let’s use our community space to be enjoyed AS SPACE, to stroll, to sit, to grow greenery—all possible if we weren’t so focused on cars and commerce.
DeleteLol what? Cars don’t own the spots, they are public. People need somewhere to park.
DeleteThere are hundreds (thousands?) of empty storefronts in Manhattan, and you want to make permanent a situation where commercial businesses commandeer for free public space that, for many, is equal or greater square footage than the actual restaurant? If there was a need for twice as many restaurant seats, we would have twice as many restaurants. There is not, unless the space is free. This is a truly nutty sentiment from what I expect are the same people who were up in arms when the city was collecting massive rents to house a restaurant in Union Square.
ReplyDeleteWe must be able to achieve some kind of middle ground. Overall, I think the streetside dining is a nice idea. In practice, the situation varies by location. There are some restaurants that do an excellent job of maintaining their sheds and keeping their customers under control. Then, there are the bad eggs who are ruining it for everyone. There's also the question of how to deal with restaurants that are unlucky to either have a bike station or bus lane outside their storefront, or who are on the second floor of a building, negating their ability to have a sidewalk shed. It's not fair to exclude these businesses.
ReplyDeleteThen there's the real problem of trash and rats. I'm finding dead rats on the sidewalk every day outside my building on First Avenue. I also see dead rats in the street. I'm guessing they're poisoned and I usually see them in the bike lane near a storm drain, right outside the restaurant sheds. Are they living underneath the sheds? Totally unsanitary. There need to be standards set for maintaining the sheds and strict rules applied to how to deal with trash. Letting food waste sit on the sidewalks all night is unacceptable.
Parking is absolutely not a better use of public space than allowing restaurants to have outdoor seating. We should be discouraging the use of personal vehicles, not continuing to encourage it by giving back space to car parking.
ReplyDeleteSet up some reasonable guidelines, eg: no amplified noise, outdoor dining stops at 11pm, clear guidance on how the structure should be maintained, etc and this could continue to be a great program.
No. Just. No.
ReplyDeleteThe rat population is totally out of control in the East Village. The sidewalks are jam packed with people waiting for tables, not to mention pedestrians having to dodge the wait personnel darting in and out of the restaurants. They're not paying for that real estate, and taxes won't be nearly enough to make up for the inconveniences to local residents (mentioned by other posters). Unlike parked cars which have to be moved in order to allow garbage trucks and street cleaners to come through, those semi-permanent structures can't just be packed up and stowed indoors. Some of the make-shift enclosures are too weak to withstand adverse weather conditions, as we have seen in the news. Some are real eyesores. Some were built like fortresses which made no sense in light of the pandemic -- if the idea was to get customers out in the open air, why permit completely enclosed booths? Anyway, no.
I'm still amazed that a 1st world city puts garbage on the curb in bags. I was happily surprised to see a neighborhood restaurant rent medium dumpsters to put next to their shed to visually hide the trash but also makes it unavailable to pests.
ReplyDeleteThe Earth School on 6th st started using carts years ago to combat their rodent problem.
Also, restaurants definitely need to be fined for making sidewalks impassable. Last spring i remember there being enforcement and city employees making sure to measure and indicate where the sheds could go and how much sidewalk space still needed to be open.
It's good to see a lot of rational people expressing both empathy and understanding as it relates to some of the reasonable issues expressed. Hopefully the people who seem to only speak in absolutes can learn some of the same. I hope that those of you that support continuing outdoor dining, while addressing some reasonable concerns, speak up in support as opposed to letting the VERY loud minority drowning out something that clearly has widespread acceptance judging by how persistently crowded outdoor dining venues are.
ReplyDeleteHey, if we're going with the "all cars are awful and all restaurants are good" mode, then why can't EVERY KIND OF BUSINESS have fREE outdoor space for its own use?
ReplyDeleteHeck, why can't I have free curb space *without having to have a commercial rental space*? I could make some nice money selling clothing from my closet, or drawing people's portraits on-the-spot, or selling my friend's ceramics, or doing graphic design - those are just a couple of ideas, and there are many more.
If curb space is supposed to be off-limits to cars, yet AVAILABLE at no cost for everyone else to make money from, then do that and see what happens to NYC. It should get really interesting very fast. All that "thinking outside the box" will be quite an adventure, I'm sure.
I want to take back the streets so I can do my massage work outdoors, which will allow my work to be much more holistic, as well as much cheaper than where I'm currently paying rent.
ReplyDeleteSo who in NYC government do I apply to, to get my share of free former-parking-lane space for my business needs?
It's been out of control. Needs to be discussed. Annoying just to walk around the neighborhood.
ReplyDeleteFor everyone complaining that they look like a shantytown, why would people have invested real money to build something up if it disappeared after a season? If we make it permanent, people will build them out for real, just like all over Europe. Grow up and realize what this city needs. No one needs a car…
ReplyDeleteMy husband and I are AGAINST making the sidewalk sheds permanent for bars and restaurants in the East Village. We are also AGAINST making the East Village a 24 hours open bar zone. If either of these proposals are allowed, it will attract even more bars and restaurant owners that will move into the East Village to profit from the free square footage, turning our residential neighborhood into an even bigger party zone with more never-ending noise, trash, rats, drunken behavior, clogged sidewalks, and lack of reasonable access for street cleaners, emergency vehicles, and residents loading/unloading. Plus, the added incentive for landlords to get higher rents from bars/restaurants could drive other small businesses out. Do we really want to live in a Bourbon Street environment? We, and our friends and neighbors, have lived here as artists and musicians for over 35 years. We are not anti-bar/restaurants. However, there must be a reasonable balance between the residential and commercial considerations for a decent quality of life for everyone.
ReplyDeleteI’m a professional Chef and 36 year resident of Alphabet City, and I say ENOUGH OF THESE SHEDS!!! Oh it’s helping the restaurants survive!! What about the places with a bus stop or fire hydrant in front of their door?? I leave my apartment most mornings around 5:30am and I see rats running around them feasting on trash and refuse!! Homeless people sleeping in and around them!! Enough!!! Give us back our sidewalks!!!
ReplyDeleteNo one would have built them if they were temporary? Clueless. To rent an equivalent sized space would have cost $100-$200 per square foot a year. The cost to construct those trailer parks cost at most a few weeks of equivalent rent. The rest is a handout.
ReplyDeleteThe DOT regulating the sheds is a joke. I complained to the DOT about a place on my street that illegally built a shed roof that extends over the sidewalk and also partially built their shed on the sidewalk and added seating along the curb, which is not allowed and has caused congestion on the sidewalk. There was even a dog biting incident because the space is so jammed with restaurant patrons and local residents trying to get through the narrowed sidewalk. The DOT came and wrote up the restaurant for the violations months ago. Guess what. Nothing has been fixed because the restaurant owner is just paying a fine and getting away with it. He is making so much money from all the extra seating, he can afford to pay the fine. And that's the end of it. We have to all be inconvenienced.
ReplyDeleteTo BGreeneK: The sad thing is the restaurant that is driving me most crazy is owned by people I have been nothing but kind to and supportive of. I now realize their neighborhood friendly vibe was all an act to get customers. When it comes to being a good neighbor, they are anything but. They blast music in their outdoor shed, they have taken over the sidewalk, they put out mounds of trash on the corner and every morning there is food all over the sidewalk and street. They don't live in the neighborhood. They are here to make money and that is it.
ReplyDeleteOutdoor dining was fine at the peak of Covid, but perhaps it’s time to get rid of it now that indoor dining is open again. Maybe extend outdoor dining until the end of this year, but that’s it. It’s become very annoying to pass by sidewalks filled with rowdy and drunken Chads and Beckys. Plus, there have been noticeably more rats in the neighborhood for sure.
ReplyDeleteAnon July 13, 2021 at 2:08 PM "Grow up and realize what this city needs. No one needs a car…"
ReplyDeleteyour name calling shows the insecurity of your position.
And yes, many people here need vehicles, as has been discussed many times on this blog. You object to individual autonomy.
anon 2:08 what do you mean no one needs a car? Maybe YOU don't, but they're obviously a very essential tool for many, many different reasons and people so chill. That said, I have a thousand other issues with this shit I want off the streets that has nothing to do with that, personally, though I do think parking is also important for peoples lives and local commerce.
ReplyDeleteWhen I wait for the bus I cannot see down the street if a dining shed is in the way. I have the buses on the phone app but it is not always reliable and I would like to be able to see the bus coming not wait until it is right on top of the stop. I can see better if I stand at the curb but I am a senior and use a cane and would rather sit on the bench at the stop.
ReplyDeletePlease go to the meeting tonight and express your concerns. Call the city directly and place complaints. Venting here may get your ire up but ultimately doesn’t help reach a consensus on how this situation should be dealt with.
ReplyDeleteLet's talk about regulating the sidewalk sheds and talk about charging for the free parking spaces. Extra payment and regulation is understandable and needed if food and drink are going to be served outside. Single use and monthly for a fee parking permits are long overdue.
ReplyDelete@2:08pm: Clearly you're living not only in the wrong city, but also in the wrong country. What you want is to live in Amsterdam, so feel free to move there. It's a place that's ALREADY everything you want (and more - they don't bother wearing masks, and they don't care about being vaccinated, either! And I know this b/c a friend of mine is a native of Amsterdam who lives there full-time).
ReplyDeleteMeanwhile, those of us living in NYC (AKA "NEW AMSTERDAM" have our own standards.
It's a long mile from "please manage the sheds better so we aren't all living in rat city" to "remove all sheds; cars only please."
ReplyDeleteI don't care for trash and rats - but honestly, why are you living in Manhattan if you want someplace quiet, and you have such a powerful need for parking? It boggles my mind.
Keep the sheds - and institute better long-term rules for them!
My only complaint with these outside sheds is there all vandalized there’s no upkeep on them I think if you can upkeep them tear them down majority especially the ones on St. Marks street are just disgusting and all the garbage they store on the side of them
ReplyDeleteThe city should allow outdoor dining for 6 more months and then shut it down. But wouldn't be surprised if a new strain of covid is introduced and indoor restrictions begin again, probably right around election time.
ReplyDelete@5:23pm: It seems pretty easy to boggle your mind.
ReplyDeleteWhy are YOU living in Manhattan, since there were no sheds to make you happy until last year? What could possibly have made this city appealing to you when there were no dining sheds in parking lanes?
I think the city you really want is New Orleans, a place where anything goes and where the crime rate it through the roof. You can really relax there, with your go-cup in hand.
Here's my position: Any restaurant that still has an outdoor dining shed after November of this year is a restaurant I won't be spending any money at, not even for take-out.
ReplyDeleteEnough is enough. The East Village looks like a slum, and the rat population is likely higher than the human population.
Our building has not had a rat issue (outdoors or indoors) in a great many years, but since April 2021, we've trapped/killed nearly 3 DOZEN rats outside on our property & most of those were adult rats. Our building does NOT house a restaurant. In fact the entire length of our block does not house any restaurants, which tells you exactly how much the dining sheds are breeding spots that facilitate the rat problem spreading onto the surrounding side streets.
Every building on our block (and we're not on an avenue) is having a rat problem, & every resident on our block is way past being fed up with this. The building supers are going nuts, and the amount of $$$$$$$ we're *all* spending to try to control rats is substantial, yet we feel we're fighting a losing battle. If those sheds continue to exist, or are made permanent, we'll know for sure that we're fighting a losing battle, and that city hall is more interested in helping rats than humans.
"Grow up"
ReplyDeleteJust another variation of the "If you don't like____, move to____" line. Or "Deal with it" . or "Get a Crip".
So tired of this.
I am so disappointed in Carlina Rivera. We have been complaining to her about the restaurants with the outdoor dining keeping our families up all night and she has been silent on this issue and hasn't done a thing to help us. None of the politicians have helped us and I don't understand why. I know real estate developers contribute to their campaigns. Maybe the restaurant industry is also a big donor. That can be the only explanation because we have been calling and emailing and gotten no help from our elected representatives.
ReplyDeleteThe dining sheds can be a bit unsightly. Maybe a few splashes of color by local artists will liven them up. This would also provide for a more fun, upbeat atomosphere! I would like to see roaming violin players to help set the mood.
ReplyDeleteIf you’ve ever wanted an example of what’s smothering the spirit of our dear city, I’m afraid you’d have to look no further than the commentariat on display here.
ReplyDeleteCars will always be needed. People that own them do not take a fun Sunday drive for the hell of it. They need it to go to their jobs that public transportation will not go to. With that said, I won a car and park in a garage. I'm fine with that. I'm also fine with adding bike lanes as I do bike. Saying you want to get rid of cars entirely is ridiculous. We need more garages and at least spaces where people can drop off the elderly, or packages, or have people park that do necessarily repairs to your building. And yes, the sheds need to go.
ReplyDeleteSure some vehicles are needed but packing our limited outdoor space with essentially a giant parking lot is madness.
DeleteIt’s the side of the road, relax. It’s already incredibly limited because nyc doesn’t have much for municipal lots.
DeleteNo, no, no- why should you get free rent when everyone else has to pay- especially when you bar/restaurant causes quality of life issues for neighbors? Pay your damn rent like everybody else!
ReplyDeleteI didn't make it to Tuesday's meeting, although I dragged myself down to 1 Centre Street last night; at that meeting, people were treating it as a done deal and were pretty much finessing the logistics of how the Open Streets program was going to play out in the long term.
ReplyDeleteI didn't sign up for this; I hate eating outdoors—always have—and these plywood shacks are kinda like treehouses but on the ground. "Let's pretend we're going out to dinner." Bottom line: this city isn't zoned for these little shacks taking up parking spaces; I don't own a car, but I don't need to see diners spilling out onto every street everywhere I go.
When this program started, I accepted it only because I thought there would be an end to it at some point; someone has to come up with a better idea.
I hope outdoor dining is here to stay forever and closing some streets to car traffic is a great idea. This neighborhood is for the people. Prople from anywhere. Compromise would be to close the sheds at midnight and if you want to drink until 4am do it indoors. And the “bro” crowd is not the only one that drinks in the village it’s a destination for all kinds of people.
ReplyDeleteCars is not a right but a privilege si deal with it. This neighborhood has been like a flower in bloom with allowance of outdoor dining in my opinion and opinion of many I talked to. And no outdoor dining is not full of drunk “bros” 99 percent of the time it’s enjoyed by normal people
I won't be surprised at all if we discover that the "fix" was already in - and that no number of people protesting at CB3 meetings will change anything. I watched part of the meeting online Tuesday night, and I was happy to hear Rivera roundly booed. (But she still somehow got voted in again.)
ReplyDeleteThe basic insanity is this: Why the fuck would the TRANSPORTATION DEPT. be involved in licensing, regulating or determining how RESTAURANTS operate?
Might as well let the Health & Hospitals Corporation run all the ordinary DOT stuff, since the DOT will be running restaurant businesses in NYC. Or perhaps the NYPD can be required to patch potholes. Or maybe the DOB can take over the bridges and tunnels, which can be re-defined as "buildings".
Or maybe someone should be honest and just say it: the SLA and Cuomo are now in charge of all restaurant and bar-related EVERYTHING in NYC, b/c (a) Cuomo needs the tax income, and (b) Cuomo thinks he's god-emperor of NY.
I was at the meeting last night and the crowd resembled a pot boiling on a stove, lid rattling and ready to blow at any moment. Finally we got to "speak our truth". People were for the most part angry that the city government had been plotting this for some time and the impression was that unless something drastic happening this will be a done deal. Our neighbors for the most part were having not any of it. Passionate 60 second speeches relayed the how the open street restaurants and bars have destroy the quality of life for anyone living next to them. The rate populations explosion due to food waste left in roads nightly, the illegal activity which occurs in street sheds late at night. The community board seemed be symbiotic with those that attended the meeting. And yes the vile Carlina Rivera got a good deserving booooo. This fight has just begun, we all need to speak up and say it loud.
ReplyDeleteI agree that some maybe many of these structures need to be tightened up, and many have taken up a unfair amount of space, but with a clean up of the rules and more responsibility and accountability there is no reason this can't be a safe and permanent addition to the neighborhood.
ReplyDeleteI have a car in the east village and parking is as hard as it was before pandemic. I also live above one of these and my bar neighbor has been very respectful of the time, all done and quiet by 11:30. The owner is also diligent in keeping the street clean and tidy. It's in his interest to keep the rats away, trash cans sealed tight and bags only out when being picked up.
We can do this well.
@8:42am: Well maybe it is done well on YOUR block, but it sure as hell isn't being done well in most places.
ReplyDeleteMaybe landlords can tout apartments for rent by saying "free adult rat with every lease!"
I don't think people have the slightest clue how much damage rats can do to infrastructure. If you think it's gross to SEE a rat on the sidewalk, wait until you have thousands of them chewing on electrical wiring underground along with Spectrum, FIOS, etc. cables & wiring. Oh, how much fun if the internet goes down for a whole area b/c of rat damage! And how long d'you imagine it'll take an entity like our local cable companies to find & fix the damage? And do you imagine you won't pay for that with higher rates?
People who "love" outdoor dining should be prepared to "love" all kinds of power problems, too. Fun times in "Fun City"!
Take a wrecking ball to these rat ranches, pronto! All the reasons y’all have said. And a wrecking ball to the feckless Carlina Rivera as well.
ReplyDeleteMore streets need to be blocked off on the weekends, imho. Need to refocus the city from car culture to pedestrian culture.
ReplyDeleteJuly 13th 10:18pm - 10:37pm HAS to be the same person and probably a lobbyist for Streetsblog. Keep you one sided, tone deaf opinions on that site. Please.
ReplyDeleteAll those worried about rats should be advocating for dumpsters. I have not noticed any increase in rats at all; to me the rat activity appears the same as before the pandemic. However, NYC needs dumpsters like any other civilized place. Throwing the bags on the ground has always been a recipe for rats. Calling for the removal of sheds without calling for installation of dumpsters is a bad faith criticism.
ReplyDeleteWith regard to the sheds, I prefer them to the high speed streets we had before the pandemic. Cars, exhaust, noise, and grit are vastly more unpleasant than some cafe society. It appears to me that most of these critics are more angry about seeing other people having a good time than anything else.
Rats have always been around, I don't see the structures adding much more. Personally I'm a big fan of the new outdoor dining culture.
ReplyDeleteBottom line: this is a massive transfer of public wealth/space to the private sector.
ReplyDeleteWhile I definitely think there needs to be stricter regulations for the dining sheds in order to better coexist with the neighbors, we should be giving restaurants at least one more year of the extra space. Yes the pandemic regulations have lifted, but many of these establishments are still paying off back rent from the past year, both for the months they had to close (some places have an entire year of back rent to pay off, with landlords that have given no rent relief), and because even establishments that were open, were making a fraction of their normal revenue due to reduced capacity restrictions and a reduced customer base. And while the regulations have now been lifted, many establishments are open with reduced hours because they are short staffed. If we want to continue to keep the small businesses that make this city special, open, we need to continue to allow them the opportunity to have the extra capacity. They have an entire year's worth of catching up to do, which many can only accomplish with the extra seating ability.
ReplyDeleteI want to see life in this neighborhood and the city. Outdoor dining should be here to stay forever. Neighborhood has been revitalized because of it and feels like Paris in some way. These no fun cry babies need to deal with it.
ReplyDeleteGo live in Europe if you love it so much. I'll take a quieter, cleaner NYC, with space for automobiles, any day.
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