tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5694390946037511355.post2240293017133837987..comments2024-03-29T00:45:13.544-04:00Comments on EV Grieve: CB3 says no to Frank's fast-food Italian on Avenue A; fishmonger also deniedUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger37125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5694390946037511355.post-26245137285567886162010-06-24T21:16:44.750-04:002010-06-24T21:16:44.750-04:00Richard - Are you Aphex Twin or using his name to ...Richard - Are you Aphex Twin or using his name to trash your neighbors?<br /><br />I do hope you go to a CB3 meeting. If you do care about living here for the long term, it is good to learn the facts and the nuances of the issues, before you speak so resolutely. They are not so simple. <br /><br />The system is broken, nobody will disagree with that. We have no real zoning, we have some ridiculous unwritten rules about transfer licenses that create a situation where any new license is a potential SuperDive, and the rules that are in place for the Resolution Area and the 500 foot rule are inconsistently applied, among many many other things that have come together to create the situation we find ourselves in today. The solution to these problems will not be fixed over night, but if people care enough, and are willing to volunteer their time to work them out, maybe we can come out the other end and have bars and restaurants for tourists like you, and also have retailers that serve the residents.<br /><br />The thing that is so infuriating about your comment is your contention that the people who are arguing against the bars don't remember what it used to be like here. <br /><br />The people arguing against the bars are twofold: first are those who have been directly impacted by a really bad neighbor from the noise and crowds, ie people who would never otherwise complain but sleepless nights have made them insane; and second are long time residents, the ones who literally, not figuratively, but literally, made this neighborhood the one that is now so attractive that people like you want to move here. They managed to take the scary elements out, and in their place, you moved in. Is that an improvement? I guess it depends on how much you've had to drink.<br /><br />These are the people you think should leave to make room for you and your personal partying desires. They aren't going to leave, they have an investment in what they have built, and your yelling at them to leave is a ridiculous argument, as ridiculous as you might think if someone suggested you leave because your new seafood restaurant failed to get approval from the Community Board (which, by the way, doesn't preclude them from applying for and getting a liquor license from the state). <br /> <br />I'm not sure how you made it here for five years as a small business owner but haven't seemed to learn much about the people in this neighborhood. The people who moved here 30 years ago spent a lot of energy trying to fit in with the largely Puerto Rican and Eastern European population that preceded them. It wasn't always easy or accepted, but the most successful tried hard to be respectful of the heritage that came before them. It's a point you seem to have missed.<br /><br />Do you think the gardens built themselves? Or that the drug dealers took themselves off the streets (and ironically into the bars they are now fighting against)? Or that the schools have vastly improved because the residents weren't fighting for them? Or all of the other things that we now benefit from through their blood, sweat and tears?<br /><br />You should be GRATEFUL that they spent the past 30 years working really hard to turn this seemingly dangerous place into the one you now want to party in all night long. Your disrespect for what they have done, and continue to work toward, will not get you very far in politics. If you plan to stay here, then you might want to learn about the people you are trashing before you do it. <br /><br />There isn't a soul who attends the Community Board meetings regularly who isn't deeply involved with the community on many levels - they are volunteering their time to try to make their neighborhood, the place they raise their families and have invested their lives, a better place. What that place might look like is open for discussion, but there is much more going on there than the approval or denial of liquor licenses. And you want them to leave? That would mean you, and your friends, would be left to run the place. Do you have the time and inclination to do it? I know I don't.Jillhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04362859175287085919noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5694390946037511355.post-54600921061627583322010-06-24T20:19:28.538-04:002010-06-24T20:19:28.538-04:00Re 25 Ave B - the issue on this is that in its pre...Re 25 Ave B - the issue on this is that in its previous incarnation it had a liquor license. CB3 has an unwritten (and in my opinion ridiculous-but this issue is a whole other can of worms and anybody interested in it is free to write me personally so I can explain it) policy to greenlight any transfer of license to a new owner. Their rationale is too long to explain here, but that would be why a "new" bar can open, but one without a license that already exists has trouble getting one. The resolution area rules are for "no NEW licenses" which means that if someone wants to open a licensed establishment, the easiest way is to buy a license from someone selling.<br /><br />here is the resolution with stipulations they agreed to for 25 Ave B: http://www.nyc.gov/html/mancb3/downloads/minutes/minutes2010-03.pdfJillhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04362859175287085919noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5694390946037511355.post-30667027759834256362010-06-24T09:59:59.967-04:002010-06-24T09:59:59.967-04:00By the way ,every signature was from cb3 constitue...By the way ,every signature was from cb3 constituents, and 70 percent of them from within four to five blocksAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5694390946037511355.post-59314715783277064842010-06-24T08:04:56.324-04:002010-06-24T08:04:56.324-04:00It sucks that this was not approved. I'm cert...It sucks that this was not approved. I'm certain that whatever winds up going in the space will be less beneficial to the neighborhood than this small, locally owned restaurant would have been.<br /><br />For Shawn Chittle: did you ACTUALLY suggest that decent seafood can be purchased at Key Food or Associated? When you make a statement as asinine as that I tend to discount anything else you say as equally dishonest.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5694390946037511355.post-48027070581060924382010-06-23T21:50:31.433-04:002010-06-23T21:50:31.433-04:00I don't feel bad for all these bar and restaur...I don't feel bad for all these bar and restaurant owners. Go to another neighborhood that really could use some nightlife and dining spots. There are plenty of areas like that in NYC but they all want to come to the EV.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5694390946037511355.post-86594335788677185472010-06-23T21:41:14.893-04:002010-06-23T21:41:14.893-04:00"We don't want 1000+ people WHO DON'T..."We don't want 1000+ people WHO DON'T LIVE IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD coming in and making a lot of noise." So you are saying if people live in the neighborhood it's fine?<br /> <br />If you want peace and quiet, move upstate. Seriously.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5694390946037511355.post-52551636683742098662010-06-23T20:46:49.693-04:002010-06-23T20:46:49.693-04:00"Overwhelming community support (obvious with..."Overwhelming community support (obvious with the 1,000+ signatures for in comparison to the 125 against). THAT, my friend, is why someone assumes their concept will work in that space."<br /><br />There is no doubt it would work. That's the problem. We don't want 1000+ people WHO DON'T LIVE IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD coming in and making a lot of noise. Good luck somewhere else. Maybe they'll be capable of understanding your reasoning.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5694390946037511355.post-62411662514670522362010-06-23T19:39:58.133-04:002010-06-23T19:39:58.133-04:00@4:34, Thanks for trying, too bad, there is so muc...@4:34, Thanks for trying, too bad, there is so much negativity, from a select few who just are more passionate, or have more time on their hands to sabotage any business besides used book stores. <br /><br />Also, I love the cape, not much to do there for work, but I live on seafood when I go, and often like a piece of whatever we can get in NYC. Might as well eat it while you can, the BPs of the world are doing a good job to make a fish monger a non starter for other reasons than CB3.Hey19noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5694390946037511355.post-26044355925729179362010-06-23T19:24:36.059-04:002010-06-23T19:24:36.059-04:00I believe you should do your research, the "r...I believe you should do your research, the "resolution" clearly states "board will grant licenses to applicants only in cases where applicant can demonstrate public benefit or substantial community support.and my leasewas contingent upon sla approval, so I didnt waste much money on the project as of yet. I'm just wasting time talking to people with closed minds that are incapable oflistening to reasonAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5694390946037511355.post-81939243648771233022010-06-23T18:47:52.952-04:002010-06-23T18:47:52.952-04:00It's true, there's always been noise and ...It's true, there's always been noise and bars and loud music in the East Village and it was awesome. Lots of interesting stores and cool people. It was the counter-culture, which railed against the mainstream, stood for freedom of expression and individuality. It was a bastion of radicalism with squatters, activists, artists and musicians. That kind of beauty can never be replaced, and it had a purpose. Today lots of people who live here are the mainstream, and these restaurants are not progressive and radical. How is being part of a system that drives out small businesses radical? The new people that these restaurants and bars are catering to are Yunnies. These restauranteurs are as right wing as they come. They kind of remind me of conservatives who support off- shore drilling. Profits over people.Cookiepusshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04788301796178375047noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5694390946037511355.post-87566252347577616492010-06-23T18:47:52.953-04:002010-06-23T18:47:52.953-04:00I have lived in the East Village for 20 years and ...I have lived in the East Village for 20 years and it is has always had bars but not the crazy amount it has now. I wouldn't care if they didn't blast music but these places are loud and we working class types have to sleep. It's never been a library around here but there is no need for it to turn into a nonstop frat party now.<br /><br />Speaking to the fish place, I have no problem with restaurants opening as long as they aren't blasting music. It is really the bars that are the problem.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5694390946037511355.post-2488104793213020242010-06-23T18:33:14.239-04:002010-06-23T18:33:14.239-04:00In a response to the above comment. What is more b...In a response to the above comment. What is more beneficial to the community than a day time food use (fish market which the e-village lacks) and a fresh seafood restaurant at night? Overwhelming community support (obvious with the 1,000+ signatures for in comparison to the 125 against). THAT, my friend, is why someone assumes their concept will work in that space.<br /><br />Obviously this isn't a bar if its agreed to close at 1am...all bars close at around 4.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5694390946037511355.post-26009064510535623592010-06-23T16:58:36.222-04:002010-06-23T16:58:36.222-04:00Re: Anonymous: "You all knew when you moved h...Re: Anonymous: "You all knew when you moved here what you were getting into, and if you want peace and quiet you really messed up by living on the avenue instead of at least a side street." <br /><br />And you sir knew when you signed your lease that the community board had a resolution area effectively outright denying any applicant unless they can substancially prove they are beneficial to the community. Maybe you should do some research next time before you invest a lot of money and get a lease outside in the resolution area.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5694390946037511355.post-59501030478752773372010-06-23T16:38:13.376-04:002010-06-23T16:38:13.376-04:00+ 1 to Anonymous above+ 1 to Anonymous aboveRichard D Jamesnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5694390946037511355.post-77264614113796659802010-06-23T16:34:58.684-04:002010-06-23T16:34:58.684-04:00I hope to attend the next meeting.
I find it hil...I hope to attend the next meeting. <br /><br />I find it hilarious that people are fighting restaurants being open in the East Village. <br /><br />1. It's the East Village, it's where people go out in NYC, if you don't like that - move to one of the outer boroughs. <br />2. Before that the East Village was somewhat sketchy this far East - remember that? Oh, probably not. <br />3. There is an incredible amount of vacant retail spaces in the East Village, specifically Alphabet City - would you rather we have more vacant spaces? I wouldn't. It's unfortunate, rents are so high for ground level retail space, it's damn near impossible for anything to go into these spaces except for chains, or stuff w/ liquor licenses. To someone who wanted a music store - you must be high, record stores are dinosaurs sadly, there is less than 25% music stores left in NYC compared to 10 years ago. <br /><br />All I know is I would prefer another restaurant (not a burger joint) to a bank, or a Subway Sandwiches. <br /><br />Also - the noise - it sucks. But it is the East Village. It is a shame that we have been overrun by former FratBoys and Wannabe Sex&The City women from Murray Hell and the UES - that said, if I REALLY wanted peace and quiet, I wouldn't live in this part of town.Richard D Jamesnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5694390946037511355.post-40364291157578938412010-06-23T16:29:49.419-04:002010-06-23T16:29:49.419-04:00soooo many points here to address Shawn. First of...soooo many points here to address Shawn. First of all , When you have been completely railroaded by the community board and more specifically, the chair of the sla subcommittee the way I have been,yes lawsuits come to mind. When a resident lies to the board,(and they do record these meetings) he is breaking the law and may be liable for damages he causes to others as a result. <br /> The drinks and food were simply consideration for nearly perfect strangers to spend almost 4 hours in a 90 degree auditorium to lend their support for a business they own no part of. Consideration there is a concept the opposition should look into. They went door to door inside of buildings bothering people to sign their petition. In the nearly 30 years I have lived in the east village I have never had my privacy disrespected in this manner. Not to mention the extra pressure this exerts on the resident in question. When i was personally collecting signatures,if two people were even talking to each other, I left them alone. If someone was on a cell phone ,I didn't disturb them. Yet these overzealous residents have the unmitigated gaul to invade the sanctity of their neighbors homes. They probably had to do this because not many people would sign it in the street. When I was gathering signatures,roughly 1 out of 50 or so people refused to sign my petition. Even with my more conservative ,polite and non-invasive method, I had more supporters from the very bldg as well as the immediate block . and roughly 900 more people from the immediate area.<br /> I offered to cut my hours down to midnight sunday thru weds and to 1:00 on weekends. show me a bar that operates on those hours and I'll grab their lease in month or two.<br /> I own an indie label.and I knew the beasties when they were stealing jackets from wienstien parties. Unfortunately through no fault of mine,the studio has left the bldg. Its been an empty eyesore for over 2 years now, and the opposition is acting like I am LeSouk or the Box. You people make me laugh,when exactly was the e.v. this quiet low key place? You all knew when you moved here what you were getting into, and if you want peace and quiet you really messed up by living on the avenue instead of at least a side street.<br />To all of you that think its sooo easy,go ahead and open a book store,or music store,or a clothing shop and start to be part of the solution,Instead of just bitching about others who are trying to bring this hood what it clearly needs and clearly supportsAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5694390946037511355.post-73835451035311974832010-06-23T16:17:57.952-04:002010-06-23T16:17:57.952-04:00I love the guy who is whining about a lack of a fi...I love the guy who is whining about a lack of a fish place. If he loves it that much, he ought to move to Cape Cod because no East Village fish joint is going to compare!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5694390946037511355.post-66919125594346535552010-06-23T16:10:11.486-04:002010-06-23T16:10:11.486-04:00OH YEAH. THIS IS MADNESS! TAKE IT FROM ME!OH YEAH. THIS IS MADNESS! TAKE IT FROM ME!The Macho Man Randy Savagenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5694390946037511355.post-5461083595661708622010-06-23T15:45:24.904-04:002010-06-23T15:45:24.904-04:00Liquor licenses aside, CB3, and NYC, really, has a...Liquor licenses aside, CB3, and NYC, really, has a lot of work to do... the retail diversity in the neighborhood is skewed now, of course, toward bars and restaurants. (East Village isn't alone in this...) A resident last night said that there are 13 more liquor licenses on Avenue A than there were five years ago...<br /><br />Anyway, helping the mom-and-pop shops and encouraing retail diversity are epic challenges....something that I'll address in a post tomorrow...EV Grievehttp://evgrieve.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5694390946037511355.post-14006608752506065032010-06-23T15:38:20.313-04:002010-06-23T15:38:20.313-04:00Agreed EV, Sigmund's is great, and would be ju...Agreed EV, Sigmund's is great, and would be just as sweet a little spot w some gewertaztraminer to go w your pretzle. Yet a bourbon st themed frat bar? Really? Seems Sigmunds is kind of the same story as the fish monger, a diversity adding place that just gets categorically denied a liscence. We need more places like Sigmunds, with or without a liscence, I dont care, with hopefully, to help them be viable. Great Jones Cafe isnt far if you really need a hurracane. So wrong, so arbitrary and petty.Hey19noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5694390946037511355.post-88505580983073272802010-06-23T15:33:14.404-04:002010-06-23T15:33:14.404-04:00Thanks, EVG
I was trying to refrain from saying &...Thanks, EVG<br /><br />I was trying to refrain from saying "Chill out, man! Can't we all just get along?" because the answer seems to be No. In a perfect world, these bar/restaurants would open and everyone would be well-behaved and happy, but experience has shown that just doesn't happen. <br /><br />If it's any consolation, some day the EV will cease to be the trendy place to be and there will be reasons to lament that, too. I just think there are more options for businesses and CB3 to explore, but no one seems to want to put the effort into being a good neighbor.Laura Goggin Photographyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15517481509431547970noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5694390946037511355.post-22576785455687546312010-06-23T15:32:08.134-04:002010-06-23T15:32:08.134-04:00Why CAN'T we just have a fish market in the &q...Why CAN'T we just have a fish market in the "central" EV? We used to have two great ones: Victor's on 1st and 13th and the one on 1st and 9th. Sometimes Essex Street or Whole Foods is just too far for those of us with walking issues...supermarket fish is unspeakable.HippieChicknoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5694390946037511355.post-24454049030437354592010-06-23T15:17:28.471-04:002010-06-23T15:17:28.471-04:00Great comment, Goggla.
There doesn't seem to ...Great comment, Goggla.<br /><br />There doesn't seem to be much common ground. Some residents have said they'd compromise... start with a beer/wine license and hold off on a sidewalk cafe... baby steps. But.<br /><br />Coexistence is possible among people who are actually neighbors.... people who all live together in the East Village... the problem is, so many of these newer places/popular joints aren't intended for, or don't appeal to, people who actually live here. <br /><br />I have yet to meet one person who has actually gone to Superdive for anything but a lark or to see how horrible it is, for instance. And places like this *mostly* attract people from other places who don't give a shit about the neighborhood.<br /><br />And places with good probable good intentions like what Frank and Keith proposed are getting punished because of the likes of Aces and Eights and Superdive. <br /><br />Uh, anyway, it's a complicated issue... but I do understand why some people are saying enough is enough with ANY new liquor licenses, intentions aside.EV Grievehttp://evgrieve.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5694390946037511355.post-72995618990007310002010-06-23T15:07:18.513-04:002010-06-23T15:07:18.513-04:00@Shawn
Thanks! With so much happening, I forgot t...@Shawn<br /><br />Thanks! With so much happening, I forgot to mention the scene in which Keith said that, yes, he did offer free drinks to people who came out to support last night.EV Grievehttp://evgrieve.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5694390946037511355.post-20124252446224118882010-06-23T15:05:43.329-04:002010-06-23T15:05:43.329-04:00@Glamma
Well, good point re: Billy Hurricane'...@Glamma<br /><br />Well, good point re: Billy Hurricane's opening at 25 Avenue B... this goes to what McWater was talking about... how does a full bar like this get the OK... yet, that new Sigmund pretzel place a few doors up B, who was looking for a beer/wine license and closes at 8 p.m., get denied because of being in a resolution area?<br /><br />This whole licensing system is fucked, really.EV Grievehttp://evgrieve.comnoreply@blogger.com